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ultraflip
03-31-2006, 07:40 AM
Cliffs: Philadelphia has found a way to save water and money, but might not be able to use it, because it would mean that union plumbers might not have enough work




Philly Plumbers Upset by Waterless Urinals
By DEBORAH YAO, Associated Press Writer 2 hours, 21 minutes ago

PHILADELPHIA - This city's hoped-for bragging rights as home of America's tallest environmentally friendly building could go down the toilet.

In a city where organized labor is a force to be reckoned with, the plumbers union has been raising a stink about a developer's plans to install 116 waterless, no-flush urinals in what will be Philadelphia's biggest skyscraper.
Developer Liberty Property Trust says the urinals would save 1.6 million gallons of water a year at the 57-story Comcast Center, expected to open next year.

But the union put out the word it doesn't like the idea of waterless urinals — fewer pipes mean less work.

The city's licensing department, whose approval is needed for waterless urinals, has not yet rendered a decision.

The mayor's office has stepped in to try to save the urinals, which use a cartridge at the base to trap odors and sediment as waste passes through.
It is telling the plumbers that the city's building boom will provide plenty of work for them and that even waterless urinal systems need some plumbing connections, said Stephanie Naidoff, city commerce director.

Philadelphia's unions have periodically put the city in a difficult spot.

For years, convention groups were canceling bookings at the Pennsylvania Convention Center because of difficulties working with six unions. New rules were established in 2003 to allow convention groups to deal instead with a middleman, a labor supplier. A few months later, the electricians union temporarily shut off power and picketed the center in a dispute with the supplier.

In 2004, the MTV reality show "The Real World" briefly pulled up stakes after union workers, in a dispute over hiring practices, picketed the house the cast was to live in. The show's producers and labor leaders eventually negotiated a deal to bring the show back.

Terry S
03-31-2006, 09:30 AM
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Terry S

kimletrim
03-31-2006, 10:30 AM
Yeah, read about it. Just what we need, more plumbers!

Terry S
03-31-2006, 10:44 AM
For those of you that work near the OC airport area, i'm sure you've seen those people standing on street corners holding up a huge banner that reads: "Shame on So-n-So company! Labor Dispute!"

They do that to companies that are building new buildings or renovating office units. They do the banner protest thing because the general contractor involved in the project bids out the work (like the drywall or plumbing) and choose a non-union company. That's it. Not because it's illegals doing the job, or because the sub-contractor is incompetant. Just because it's a non-union sub-contractor.

And to put the cherry on top, the people holding the signs are their professional picketters, not actual working union members as required per law. They bring these people "into the union" and rotate them around the southland, paying them the hourly wage that a picketting member is allowed to earn by law (something like 12 bucks an hour).

Fucking awesome, huh?

Terry S

rammsteinmatt
03-31-2006, 12:22 PM
hey, terry where are these people? i need a job, and hell $12/hr for doing nothing is pretty good :2funny:

or we can organize a drive-by

Terry S
03-31-2006, 12:34 PM
All over the place. I saw some guys protesting over by the airport last week. You could probably go ask them what union their in.

Terry S

rammsteinmatt
03-31-2006, 01:09 PM
All over the place. I saw some guys protesting over by the airport last week. You could probably go ask them what union their in.

Terry S


that was a joke big terry. who in their right mind with above a high school education would ever join a union?

unions went out of style (and lost their original purpose) once working conditions improved around the 1920's. unions are to prevent accidnets like the shirt waist fire of 1910 where something like 70 women were killed because of locked doors, to prevent unauthorized breaks, kept them in during a fire. they are not useful for creating a situation where they either want $11/hr vs $10/hr, or they wont work. news flash! if you dont like your current job, get a new one, but chances are the union has so artificially inflated your skills/title/pay that comming back to reality will be a harsh lesson

example: costco (some of them) are unionized by teamsters. they have a starting pay of $10/hr. that means that someone is being paid $10/hr to load items into a cart (to increase check register efficiency, no less). you dont even have to speak english to get that job, technically speaking you dont but ethically you should. this is the epitome of unskilled labor, yet they are paid much greater than minimum wage because the union's "got their back". well, isnt that convenient?

understandably the unions should not just go away completely. there are some jobs that are legitimately dangerous enough to warrant the use of a union. linemen, are a good example of this. but costco workers? please, its not that dangerous of a job (dont even bitch, i used to work there i know how "poor" the working conditions are there. ya thats right, i was matt the teamster for 2 months) all accidnets at a place like costco can easily be eliminated with common sense (although some of the people they employ there seem to be lacking it completely). "use a rod to dislodge cardboard in the compacter. NEVER ENTER THE COMPACTOR FOR ANY REASON TO PREVENT SERIOUS INJURY OR DEATH" well good thing we got out that out of the way, i was thinking of taking by break in there. "beware of moving forklifts, the battery used to power them weighs more than an average car, and braking distances are very long as a result" lets see, car like object with long prongs on the front, never would have guessed not to play chicken with it down the aisle.

chrisalishuss
03-31-2006, 01:23 PM
warning signs are hilarious sometimes... I swear they should have them on bicycles," accelerates faster down hill" lol. im sure someone has been sued over something stupid like that. I mean the mcdonalds coffee thing, ITS SMOKING, wouldnt you generally assume that is was pretty damn hot if its smoking, at least hot enough that you wouldnt be pinching it in between your thighs.

Terry S
03-31-2006, 01:30 PM
that was a joke big terry. who in their right mind with above a high school education would ever join a union?


My bad, missed the sarcasm there. :P Damn serious meetings here at work.

Terry S

rammsteinmatt
03-31-2006, 02:21 PM
I mean the mcdonalds coffee thing, ITS SMOKING, wouldnt you generally assume that is was pretty damn hot if its smoking.


first, its steam. not smoke.

second steam depends on ambient temperature. ie. you could have steam comming off liquid at 40*F if the ambient temperature was cool enough

ya, that lady was pretty dumb. but now she's a pretty dumb millionare, so was she really that dumb?

ultraflip
03-31-2006, 02:23 PM
I mean the mcdonalds coffee thing, ITS SMOKING, wouldnt you generally assume that is was pretty damn hot if its smoking.


first, its steam. not smoke.

second steam depends on ambient temperature. ie. you could have steam comming off liquid at 40*F if the ambient temperature was cool enough

ya, that lady was pretty dumb. but now she's a pretty dumb millionare, so was she really that dumb?


yes.. she was really that dumb... it just didn't help that the court system is just as stupid for even upholding a case like that

Bills Evo
03-31-2006, 02:34 PM
Well, I have a Masters Degree and belong to a union! Public school teachers MUST join the union (closed shop). I have no choice, assuming I want to work where I work. AND I have to pay $510/year in union dues!
And I must contribute to political funds! The +side to it is that I have the best health benefits available and make 2-3x what private school teachers make. I just don't like not having a choice. Bill

Highrever
03-31-2006, 02:57 PM
Jimmy Hoffa would be rolling around in his watery grave, if we could find it, to know his son is doing absolutley nothing heading up the labor union. I agree, unions these days are a former shadow of themselves and are genrally not needed. All they ever did for me working at a grocery store out of high school was take my money.

rammsteinmatt
03-31-2006, 03:03 PM
Well, I have a Masters Degree and belong to a union! Public school teachers MUST join the union (closed shop). I have no choice, assuming I want to work where I work. AND I have to pay $510/year in union dues!
And I must contribute to political funds! The +side to it is that I have the best health benefits available and make 2-3x what private school teachers make. I just don't like not having a choice. Bill


willingly joining and being forced to join are two seperate things like you mentioned, but thats not the point. also you bring a good point. if you dont want to be a member of a union, what is your option? work at a private school at severely reduced pay and benefits. thats a slippery slope if you ask me.

so what good is the union? the union was created to protect working conditions and make it safe for people to work. last i checked very few teachers are exposed to less than ideal working conditions. (not having current textbooks and insufficent computers does not qualify as unsafe conditions). they get higher pay and better benefits, both good, but not really protecting working conditions


down here at our school district (charter oak USD) they also force the teachers to register democrat along with forcing them to register for union membership. 2 years ago, the union put out a strike of sorts, for better pay or something. techers were required to participate, or suffer informal humiliation among fellow teachers for not being a "team player". im glad we have people like this teaching kids :roll:

Terry S
03-31-2006, 03:45 PM
...snip...down here at our school district (charter oak USD) they also force the teachers to register democrat along with forcing them to register for union membership. 2 years ago, the union put out a strike of sorts, for better pay or something. techers were required to participate, or suffer informal humiliation among fellow teachers for not being a "team player". im glad we have people like this teaching kids :roll:


Where's that nazi goku pic? That pic was the first thing that popped into my head.

Terry S

andykin
04-05-2006, 11:49 PM
Cliffs: Philadelphia has found a way to save water and money, but might not be able to use it, because it would mean that union plumbers might not have enough work




Philly Plumbers Upset by Waterless Urinals
By DEBORAH YAO, Associated Press Writer 2 hours, 21 minutes ago

PHILADELPHIA - This city's hoped-for bragging rights as home of America's tallest environmentally friendly building could go down the toilet.

In a city where organized labor is a force to be reckoned with, the plumbers union has been raising a stink about a developer's plans to install 116 waterless, no-flush urinals in what will be Philadelphia's biggest skyscraper.
Developer Liberty Property Trust says the urinals would save 1.6 million gallons of water a year at the 57-story Comcast Center, expected to open next year.

But the union put out the word it doesn't like the idea of waterless urinals — fewer pipes mean less work.

The city's licensing department, whose approval is needed for waterless urinals, has not yet rendered a decision.

The mayor's office has stepped in to try to save the urinals, which use a cartridge at the base to trap odors and sediment as waste passes through.
It is telling the plumbers that the city's building boom will provide plenty of work for them and that even waterless urinal systems need some plumbing connections, said Stephanie Naidoff, city commerce director.

Philadelphia's unions have periodically put the city in a difficult spot.

For years, convention groups were canceling bookings at the Pennsylvania Convention Center because of difficulties working with six unions. New rules were established in 2003 to allow convention groups to deal instead with a middleman, a labor supplier. A few months later, the electricians union temporarily shut off power and picketed the center in a dispute with the supplier.

In 2004, the MTV reality show "The Real World" briefly pulled up stakes after union workers, in a dispute over hiring practices, picketed the house the cast was to live in. The show's producers and labor leaders eventually negotiated a deal to bring the show back.

Dude we gotta support Mario and Luigi