effects of overscaled injectors

[yajo]

hey guys, i tried searching, but didn't find much info..

but i was just wondering, if u were to overscale your injectors (ie: you own 660cc and scaled them as if 720cc injectors),

what would the effects to the injector be.. and how quickly? I've heard a lotta peoples' different responses like...

- the injector immediately is rendered useless as it will forever innaccurately distribute the fuel..
- the injectors will be fine. overscaling will not cause the injector to "go bad," they'll just not perform correctly when overscaled.
- over a long period of time the injectors COULD go bad, but most likely not..

bleh.. the last one's kinda general, but.. i'm just curious.. if they do go bad, is it an instant effect.. a super long term effect, or wat...

Thanks,

John

[antox18]

scaling is done injector specific for a reason. u might be maxing out your 660cc. its kike this...if it is fine to do this dont you think everyone would be doing it. its like scaling your stock injectors as 660cc.just doesnt sound right. well thats my 2 cents. O0

[yajo]

umm.. i'm not sure if maybe i wrote it wrong or u read it wrong... but to clarify:

i'm asking what are the effects to the injector.. i know they wont function correctly,
but i'm wonder whats the damage? will it go bad or will it still be usable when correctly scaled again..

[S2myEVO]

scaling is done injector specific for a reason. u might be maxing out your 660cc. its kike this...if it is fine to do this dont you think everyone would be doing it. its like scaling your stock injectors as 660cc.just doesnt sound right. well thats my 2 cents. O0

good analogy

[antox18]

i dont think that their r any effects to the injector. they will just max out at a certain point. but im no evo shop owning mechanic so dont take my word for it. oh and im still working on getting u those pics for the hoods. and how much for your bumper O0 lol had to bring it up

[antics22]

Heres another twist to the question.

Say hypothetically you buy some injectors and youre told they're 720's... so u tell your tuner they are 720's.. come later, you find out they were actually 660s mis-represented as 720's... Aside from getting fucked on the original purchase, would there have been any adverse effects to the injectors as they were scaled improperly by the tuner?

did i get that right Yajo? lol

And i suppose I could add to the question with a follow-up question: Is there a way to check exactly what size the injectors are, other than by sending them to some injector specialist?

[Charlie@MFQ]

Heres another twist to the question.

Say hypothetically you buy some injectors and youre told they're 720's... so u tell your tuner they are 720's.. come later, you find out they were actually 660s mis-represented as 720's... Aside from getting fucked on the original purchase, would there have been any adverse effects to the injectors as they were scaled improperly by the tuner?

did i get that right Yajo? lol

And i suppose I could add to the question with a follow-up question: Is there a way to check exactly what size the injectors are, other than by sending them to some injector specialist?


+1000. Denso 660cc and 720cc flow almost identical. I have injectors clean/flow test at RC engineering pretty often. Some Denso 660cc actually flow more or the same as the 720cc

[yajo]

Heres another twist to the question.

Say hypothetically you buy some injectors and youre told they're 720's... so u tell your tuner they are 720's.. come later, you find out they were actually 660s mis-represented as 720's... Aside from getting fucked on the original purchase, would there have been any adverse effects to the injectors as they were scaled improperly by the tuner?

did i get that right Yajo? lol

And i suppose I could add to the question with a follow-up question: Is there a way to check exactly what size the injectors are, other than by sending them to some injector specialist?
shh!

[antics22]

just trying to help out Yajo... lol...

[yajo]

man, u calling me yajo just feels odd..

[oldevodude]

hey guys, i tried searching, but didn't find much info..

but i was just wondering, if u were to overscale your injectors (ie: you own 660cc and scaled them as if 720cc injectors),

what would the effects to the injector be.. and how quickly? I've heard a lotta peoples' different responses



like...

- the injector immediately is rendered useless as it will forever innaccurately distribute the fuel..
False

- the injectors will be fine. overscaling will not cause the injector to "go bad," they'll just not perform correctly when overscaled.

True
- over a long period of time the injectors COULD go bad, but most likely not..
True but not because of wrong scaling just natural for ALL injectors or parts :)

bleh.. the last one's kinda general, but.. i'm just curious.. if they do go bad, is it an instant effect.. a super long term effect, or wat...

Depends on nature of failure but not due to incorrect scaling.


Thanks,

John

[DTunedEvoX]

Nothing- they just wont be working the way they are.. No EXTRA Damage besides regular wear and tear.

Remember back b4 people were using ECUFlash- people were using SAFC's to tune and the ECU still did not know what type of injectors you used. You just used the SAFC to adjust flow by a percentage.

Sooooo - no, besides normal wear and tear- there SHOULDNT be any additional "damage" to the injectors. They dont have a cpu/brain or any weird thing in em that'd caues them to malfunctional, just regular wear and tear parts.

[littlejap33]

y would u want ur injectors to run 100% ..because wht if ur injectors get fucked up ??

i would recomend scale ur injectors 80% max

[yajo]

alrite.. since people still don't get exactly whats going on.. (even after ant somehow spilled the beans), i'll put it plain and simple..


i bought injectors off a user from SCE (used) a while ago.. he sold them to me as denso 720cc (yes i know they don't make 720's, maybe he said 770cc)..

i took them and had them installed, and when it came time for scott grey to rape my car with a quick 15min tune, he asked me what size injectors, i replied 720cc..

after the 10min supa tune.. i drove home yadda yadda.. a day or two later, a checkengine light popped up.. p0300.. and so.. yadda yaddda.. long story short, i swapped

in my stockers, and the cel is gone (after naji rescaled me back to stock of course)..

now, being the cheap asian i am, i'm wondering if i was to throw the injectors back in, and rescale them for 660cc, which is what most and myself believe these to be,

will there be any defect or problems from running them as 720's.. keep in mind this is the short version of the story.. it actually was on the car for probably 6 months..

[jello810]

to solve your problem, buy my NIB RC 750 cc injectors and have it scaled.

[yajo]

not looking for a solution, looking for an answer to my question, but thanks..

pm me how much ure looking for..

[jello810]

YGPM...BTW, stop being cheap. It costs more in the long run...hahahaha

[Saosin]

y would u want ur injectors to run 100% ..because wht if ur injectors get fucked up ??

i would recomend scale ur injectors 80% max
fyi some people run at like 110% or 120%

[oldevodude]

y would u want ur injectors to run 100% ..because wht if ur injectors get fucked up ??

i would recomend scale ur injectors 80% max
fyi some people run at like 110% or 120%


Just because some do it does not make it right.............

a quote and a link from RC's website other injector sites will say the same note the industry standard comment..

"Most injectors will max out at 80% duty cycle and this is the accepted industry standard"

http://www.rceng.com/technical.aspx

I knew it was time to upgrade injectors when my stockers hit over 100% duty cycleÂ* according to Evoscan.

PS properly scaled injectors has nothing to do with duty cycle in so much as the chosen injectors should not exceed 80% duty cycle on the car with the mods it has hopefully this makes sense.

I am not trying to bust anybodys chops here just trying to offer good info. is all.....

[Saosin]

y would u want ur injectors to run 100% ..because wht if ur injectors get fucked up ??

i would recomend scale ur injectors 80% max
fyi some people run at like 110% or 120%


Just because some do it does not make it right.............

a quote and a link from RC's website other injector sites will say the same note the industry standard comment..

"Most injectors will max out at 80% duty cycle and this is the accepted industry standard"

http://www.rceng.com/technical.aspx

I knew it was time to upgrade injectors when my stockers hit over 100% duty cycleÂ* according to Evoscan.

PS properly scaled injectors has nothing to do with duty cycle in so much as the chosen injectors should not exceed 80% duty cycle on the car with the mods it has hopefully this makes sense.

I am not trying to bust anybodys chops here just trying to offer good info. is all.....


i know its not good im just saying so that he knows.i need me some 880cc or 1,000cc injectors *sigh*

[yajo]

thanks for the info. so these should be fine.. just need a proper scaling :) thanks!

[javicracer]

what do u mean that denso don't make 720 injectors?

[yajo]

what do u mean that denso don't make 720 injectors?
nvm. meant that he sold them to me as 720's, but they are 660's.

[oldevodude]

thanks for the info. so these should be fine.. just need a proper scaling :) thanks!


you are welcome.

ps you wil ltruly know they are fine when your fuel trims all measure plus or minus 2-3 percent and then your injector duty cycle is below 100 or 80 preferrably but yeah not sure of your mods but you will most likely be fine...

[Looney Tuning]

Stop being cheap and get NEW RC 750 injectors. IMO, you should not buy used injectors. Used injectors ought to be cleaned before you use them. RC charges $90 to clean injectors. The money you save on getting used injectors, you will pay on getting them cleaned.

The guy you bought the injectors from TOLD you that he cleaned them, but do you trust him? RC gives you a printout of the flow and the rating of the injectors after the clean-up. Did he provide you with one? BTW, how did you know that they were 660s and not 720s?

The fact that the CEL went away after you swapped back to stock, tells me that there is something wrong with these injectors.

I will never trust used injectors or used cams on my car. These are consumables and ought to be bought new. RC 1000 injectors were $360 from RRE.

[yajo]

Stop being cheap and get NEW RC 750 injectors. IMO, you should not buy used injectors. Used injectors ought to be cleaned before you use them. RC charges $90 to clean injectors. The money you save on getting used injectors, you will pay on getting them cleaned.

The guy you bought the injectors from TOLD you that he cleaned them, but do you trust him? RC gives you a printout of the flow and the rating of the injectors after the clean-up. Did he provide you with one? BTW, how did you know that they were 660s and not 720s?

The fact that the CEL went away after you swapped back to stock, tells me that there is something wrong with these injectors.

I will never trust used injectors or used cams on my car. These are consumables and ought to be bought new. RC 1000 injectors were $360 from RRE.
haha.. ya i feel ya naji.. i know i messed up in buying used stuff, though they are still working injectors.. better to have that extra 10% out of 110% clear conscience. btw, naji.. check your cell for my text.. call me cheap after u see that bad boy..

[funks]

Stop being cheap and get NEW RC 750 injectors. IMO, you should not buy used injectors. Used injectors ought to be cleaned before you use them. RC charges $90 to clean injectors. The money you save on getting used injectors, you will pay on getting them cleaned.

The guy you bought the injectors from TOLD you that he cleaned them, but do you trust him? RC gives you a printout of the flow and the rating of the injectors after the clean-up. Did he provide you with one? BTW, how did you know that they were 660s and not 720s?

The fact that the CEL went away after you swapped back to stock, tells me that there is something wrong with these injectors.

I will never trust used injectors or used cams on my car. These are consumables and ought to be bought new. RC 1000 injectors were $360 from RRE.


How about the RC650's? Would one of those be able to max out an EVOIX w/ all the bolt on mods, stock turbo while keeping the max injector duty cycle less than 80%?

[oldevodude]

Stop being cheap and get NEW RC 750 injectors. IMO, you should not buy used injectors. Used injectors ought to be cleaned before you use them. RC charges $90 to clean injectors. The money you save on getting used injectors, you will pay on getting them cleaned.

The guy you bought the injectors from TOLD you that he cleaned them, but do you trust him? RC gives you a printout of the flow and the rating of the injectors after the clean-up. Did he provide you with one? BTW, how did you know that they were 660s and not 720s?

The fact that the CEL went away after you swapped back to stock, tells me that there is something wrong with these injectors.

I will never trust used injectors or used cams on my car. These are consumables and ought to be bought new. RC 1000 injectors were $360 from RRE.


How about the RC650's? Would one of those be able to max out an EVOIX w/ all the bolt on mods, stock turbo while keeping the max injector duty cycle less than 80%?


I think it might be close depending on how many bolt ons you did. I'm not the expert here but why not 750's as posted earlier?

[PUNISHER]

What are you talking about denso does make 720cc injectors, those are the ones I have...


Nevermind.....

[xxxAce21xxx]

hmm i have some precision 780cc's idk if the previous owner cleaned um or not now im worried after reading this thread havent instaleld um yet where can i get these cleaned ? help me out guys

[oldevodude]

RC engineering will clean them

[xxxAce21xxx]

where they located ?>

[EvoJoe]

where they located ?>


Torrance: http://www.rceng.com/index.aspx